China earthquake, 20k+ dead. Please help

Posted: Wed May 21, 2008 3:04 pm

beheaded7 wrote:

:{ lol im only 13 i would send money but im flat broke....

I know how you feel bro im 12 with 1600euro Crying or Very sad

Although i did manage to spare 20dollars to the relief

Posted: Wed May 21, 2008 4:30 pm

Xerom wrote:

First, why is North America sending China MORE money then we already give them normally? I mean China has North America's economy is a strangle hold where we have virtually everything made in China (Try to find stuff made in the USA or Canada), that take jobs away domestically, and then we take whatever money we have left in North America, and hand that over for their products. Basically China makes money from taking jobs away from the USA and Canada (through labor that can be taxed), and given more money when we buy at Walmart.

If most of North America's Money is not good enough to fix China's problem, then small $50 dollar donations is not going to do a damn thing. Sorry!

The second point I want to make is Myanmar. THIS IS A PLACE THAT NEEDS HELP!!! However the problem is the military government. How do you know you funds will go to help the people of Myanmar, and not used to strengthen the military regime? Myanmar military government already has a track record of putting the military needs of it's government before the needs of it's people ( a milder version of North Korea)...why would they do anything different this time? This is what's wrong with the world. You have people that need genuine help, a world willing to help, and you have a small group of asseholes with guns stealing it for themselves.

I wish the Myanmar government would just pick a relief organization (ANY ORGANIZATION) that would not subject to suspicion, and allowed to act as a conduit for Myanmar's relief.

Going through a Military governement is no different than giving money to the Durfer government (or any other African Military government) to help it's people, and that money ending up used for military purposes.

It's sad.

Look I support what ISO Hunt is doing and the sentiment of people who are donating to something they believe is a good cause. We need more people like you in the world. All I'm saying is be more cautious as to who you give your money to, and knowing how EXACTLY that money will be flowing through.

Xenophobia and paranoia are no excuse not to give.

50 dollars won't make a difference? To quote a favorite band of mine "You may say I make no difference, but at least I'm f**kin trying. What the f**k have you done?"

I'm so stoked my first post is so negative.

Give, people. If you don't trust isohunt, find someone you do.

Posted: Thu May 22, 2008 11:43 am

I've been called EVIL, possibly nazi, and someone mentioned how I'm complaining like a credit card holder complaining about their debt. I think you missed the point.

On a side note, I'm not referring to how much money North America owes China, and the screwed up trade imbalance that is raping North America as a whole, I'm referring to total money and resource Chin has at it's disposal to help it's people.

Though the issue about the trade imbalance is something I agree with you on. It needs to be fixed in order to be a free market, and those multinational corporations (who are sending jobs overseas for a higher profit margin) and those bought-out politicians are traitors to every working person in North America. That's an issue for another time.

My point is we have 2 disasters, which one is in greater need? Here are some hard facts on both situations:

*********************************************************
Myanmar (Burma)

134,000 Killed (UN report on CNN Asia). Possibly as high as 217,000 by local reports.
56,000 Missing Persons

60% of the country's food has been destroyed.
30,000 KIDS FACING STARVATION
Between 1.6 million and 2.5 million don't have access to the basics of life (food water shelter) and are in serious risk of starvation and death.

Of the population of Myanmar, over 45% of homes have been destroyed.

WHO Ministry of Health reports severe issue getting medical help to certain affected areas of the country

Homeless rate: 2,400,000

$93.77 billion Gross Domestic Product

Official government statement as of May 19, 2008: "The Generals say their soldiers have already completed all the relief work that is needed. No further assistance needed."

******************************************************************

China
51,151 Killed Officially (as of May 22th reported by AP Press), as high as 80,000 (in the last 24 Hours)
29,328 Missing
288,431 people were injured

Hospitals have taken in 68,608 injured people Since the quake. 28,497 Have been treated and released. 33,665 are currently be treated. More are being treated in outlaying hospitals for treatment.

Homeless rate: 5,000,000

$10.17 trillion Gross Domestic Product

******************************************************************

China is getting a steady flow of relief domestically and internationally. They have a government open to aid, and in infrastructure to help it's affected people. Also with $10 Trillion of GPD (TEN Times as much as Myanmar), China has the money it needs to help itself. China does require help for its homeless with things like tents, blankets, etc. No risk of disease outbreak, and the sick and injured are being helped.

Myanmar, on the other hand, lacks the basic infrastructure, and political attitude to its people, to deal with this massive disaster. China is not in fear of starving to death, or almost half their homes are gone, or high risk of water born disease outbreaks that can claim more lives.

Here's the problem, Myanmar obviously needs more help than China , but the military government of Myanmar has shown again and again, that their only interest is only for its own government. An example is how town centers and schools that were used for shelter by the homeless victims of the cyclone were kicked out so the government can do business. The government is also known for financial corruption. My issue is not, "Don't give help because everyone should take care of their own...",my concern is making sure help reaches the victims. I would be more comfortable with sending money to habitat for humanity, or a Home Depot Charity Team to go to Myanmar and build homes directly for the victims. As of right now, Myanmar is accepting ONLY NON WESTERN Aid called Association of South-East Asian Nations (ASEAN).

Yes it sucks. The thing is you can't force help on a nation if they don't want it. Unless that government says they want help, legally we can't force help on their nation without overthrowing the established government. Donating money to Myanmar (even though they need it more than China), only to have that aid never to be allowed into their company is pointless. Worse, money could be accepted and used by a corrupt government, and the victims get nothing except more exploited.

Personally I feel China is in a better position to help it's people, than Myanmar. They have a country with industries that can build damn near anything they require, and great infrastructure to deal with emergencies, alot more media coverage (when was the last time you heard of Myanmar in the news since China?), and an open view of accepting help from the rest of the world. Myanmar has NONE of that, and it's going to get worse (according to the UN, WHO, and many other humanitarian organizations.

Look I'm not saying you shouldn't give in a time of need, all I'm saying is restrain from the emotional reaction of a disaster, take a step back and look at who you are giving your money to and how EXACTLY it will reach those who need help. Research what you are supporting and that it will actually help people, and not be wasted.

I speak from experience here. I routinely give to charities (particularly to world relief efforts). The last charities I gave to was called WaterAid for $500, a great program to provide clean water to ALL of the world through education and supplies. I also gave a few hundred to the Wiki Project, to send Wikipedia to school arond the planet..particularly to those without internet or updated classrooms.

There are alot of times well meaning people try to help people during a disaster and either than money doesn't make it to the victims, or worse is conned.

An example is Hurricane Katrina. Many people were conned. Some money ended up in the hands of administration costs. Others ended up in other FEMA programs. Some ended up in the hands up people who bought up land to make a profit.

All I'm saying is do a little research. Don't just go by emotion. Take time to make sure your help will actually help.

Posted: Thu May 22, 2008 4:56 pm

Just find it starnge that im being asked for donations to china when Chinas economy is higher than that of the UK now ( doesnt make sense )

Posted: Thu May 22, 2008 7:46 pm

bingobear wrote:

Just find it starnge that im being asked for donations to china when Chinas economy is higher than that of the UK now ( doesnt make sense )

What's the death toll in the UK from cyclones and earthquakes this month?

Posted: Fri May 23, 2008 12:36 am

Why 1 of the richest countries in the world which also has a population of 1 billion person need donations to save some 50,000 ppl of their own country ??

or are they just good at storming all the world with their cheap ( junk ) products !!

They don't need our charity .. they don't even believe in god ..

Posted: Fri May 23, 2008 2:12 am

Trollster (next post) is right. I responded in an economic way to all the ignorant claims only because they anger me so given the immense distaster China is facing. Don't spew your hatred in a support thread.

Posted: Fri May 23, 2008 2:24 am

To those in this post above me

A school in china was destroyed, the amount of kids killed was about the same amount of people in the town I grew up in. If I can give a dollar to someone who can give that dollar to one of those parents of one of them kids for any purpose I will gladly do so. Can we please keep the politics out of peoples suffering, I find it rude and distastful

thankyou EZ2B0F0

Posted: Fri May 23, 2008 10:19 am

EZ2B0F0 wrote:

Trollster (next post) is right. I responded in an economic way to all the ignorant claims only because they anger me so given the immense distaster China is facing. Don't spew your hatred in a support thread.

+1 for that. Wink

Posted: Fri May 23, 2008 8:36 pm

FYI, the Salvation Army is a church, not a charity. Donations to the Salvation Army go almost entirely towards paying for its operations and its staff's salaries.

Posted: Sat May 24, 2008 3:24 pm

i whish i could Sad

i am broke

Posted: Sun May 25, 2008 5:33 pm

looks like there were some pretty severe aftershocks today resulting in even more collapsed buildings and houses.
So it looks like it still isn't over, I hope china learns from this like japan has and starts building with much more strict earthquake proofing codes. Many of these buildings would have endured if only they had building codes like japan or even less strict ones like California here in the US

Posted: Tue May 27, 2008 4:26 am

this is a brilliant act on your behalf it is amazing that such a tragic situation can bring so many people together my company has sent 5000 5 man tents to the rural parts of china which i personally accompanied and the magnitude
is beyond comprehension

Posted: Tue May 27, 2008 10:18 am

Here are Three Rules for People looking to make their Donation mean something.

1) Know the relief organization you are giving money to!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Are they a religious or political based organization? How much of your donation goes to administrative costs? Is your donation going to a specific fund that can't be used for anything else other than the disaster fund you are donating to, or can the funds be diverted to other things? What is their relief organizations specialty (e.i. Medicine, schooling, construction, etc)? Are they really going to make a big difference to victims or just going toi get in the way of an organization that is better suited for that specific disaster zone? Will the affected country allow this organization to cross it's borders?

These are the BASIC questions you need to answer to make sure your donation will actually do something. Be an educated donator is all I'm saying.

2) RESEARCH THE NEED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

People donate to charities thinking that if they throw money at the problem, the problem will go away. It's a sad commentary on our instant gratification world attitude. It's a feel good reaction to tragedy. It usually doesn't do much except end up in surplus funds or gets used to buy needed resources. Both are delays to getting help to people.

Go online and read specifically what a disaster area needs. Sometimes an area needs specific trained individuals (like doctors or builders), or specific medicines (contact a local pharma chain and suggest they donate some needed medicine for relief and allow them to market it), or basics of life needs (like tents, water purifiers). Yes Money can be used buy or hire these people, but there are usually delays, and wasting time shopping or trying to hire/ recruit people for jobs can take time. Time always works against victims.

Example China has money and man power to build tents but not enough time to produce what they require in a timely fashion to meet the need of the victims. Sending Tents directly to China for that purpose is great way of helping out. U commend the poster that sent 5000 5 man tents. That is directly providing help where there is a resource requested. Great work researching the needs of the victims and going out of your way to help! That is the kind of help that does something.

3) Politics***********************

Lastly a few posters mentioned that politics should not come into play when donating. This is just ignorant for so many reasons. First, despite whatever relief organization you use, that organization still has to go through whatever government of that affected nation will grant them access to. A relief organization can't force themselves into a country that doesn't want them. That's why politics is a factor. We are seeing that crap in Burma.

Secondly you must know the politics of were you are donating to make sure it's not being siphoned off for government / military support purposes. Again aid flows THROUGH a governments system and laws...not around them.

Another thing about politics is knowing if the aid will make things worse politically in a nation or incite other problems. An example is non Muslim relief workers in Iraq. Their intentions on helping the displaced and hurt and poor are noble, but in an already paranoid about the west trying to convert them...has lead to kidnappings, ransoms, and murder of relief workers. You do not want to know it was you money that sent some well meaning person into an area they shouldn't be.

Research the organization you are donating to, what their politics are, and how politically neutral they are. International neutrality in aspects like religious makeup, national origin, political activism.... mean that a nation's resistance to accepting help will be minimal> That means help reaches victims, rather than stalled by political stonewalling.

Posted: Wed May 28, 2008 1:11 am

I feel so bad for the Chinese people. I wish there were words that would comfort them but only time can bring some degree of healing to this tragedy. I am praying for them. My hope is that this will in some ways make them, an already strong people, even stronger.